Vlog captioning is translation

25 Responses

• 

  Jared Evans | January 26th, 2007 @ 11:31 am

  For companies like CNN or other professional media TV/Movie companies, all the hard work of captioning has ALREADY BEEN DONE! It’s a kid’s play for these video wizards to create the same clip but with captions/subtitles burnt directly onto the screen.

  This is almost silly in my eyes that they aren’t doing this at all. It’s not like they need to hire another translator to create the subtitles from scratch.

  I believe that this is the next major issue where the Deaf collective, be they Signing, Oral, Hard-of-Hearing, Late-Deafened, etc will come together to push this agenda on a national level.
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  chrisH | January 26th, 2007 @ 11:36 am

  “It’s like hearing people having difficulty understanding a person with a heavy accent. Captions would help in these cases.”

  Yes, I agree with you but an issue is very sticky.
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  RLM | January 26th, 2007 @ 11:57 am

  I never had any problem reading others’ signings on the vlogs.

  I could understand about some people having difficulty of reading ASL on the 1-D concept (flat screen) as compared to the real texture of ASL in 3-D.

  Vloggers really do not have to burden themselves with additional tasks of captioning their vlog webcasts.

  I offer Jamie Berke my personal service of translating the vloggers’ ASL into written texts. I never heard anything from Jamie Berke. How typical of Jamie Berke!

  Robert L. Mason (RLM)
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  tayler | January 26th, 2007 @ 11:59 am

  RLM, let’s play nice!
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  Carl Schroeder | January 26th, 2007 @ 12:00 pm

  Everyone is entitled to his or her opinion. Doing vlogs is, to paraphrase Amy Cohen Efron, art work. Each artist makes his or her own masterpiece.
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  Debby | January 26th, 2007 @ 12:16 pm

  I do not understand the hostility of those who are “outraged” at Jamie, like she had the nerve to even ask. As I understand it, she was merely asking, as a member of the Deaf community, for her fellow v/bloggers to do a favor. I don’t see her kicking and screaming and ordering people around. I agree with most of you, captioning is a personal choice. Heck, v/blogging is supposed to replace a personal diary in a way. I analogize captioning with using certain words in your blogs or whether to take extra care in “polishing up” your blog to make it clear of errors (my readers know i dont care about being all proper, and my so-called laziness may turn off some people but that’s my choice). If you want more viewers, you caption. If you don’t care, then you don’t. Just don’t expect to win awards or have high hits for advertising purposes or whatever if you have a low # of viewers.
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  DT | January 26th, 2007 @ 12:22 pm

  Tayler, I completely get what your’e saying about translating but it just seems to me that if I translate my own vlogs, the translating should be a slam dunk as I “own” what I’m saying and, therefore, the translation will be “true”, no? So if all vloggers translate their own work, what’s the problem in as far as accuracy is concerned?
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  moi | January 26th, 2007 @ 12:42 pm

  DT, I beg to differ. Because of the nature of my job, I frequently have to translate between the two languages on the fly – a fair bit of it my OWN signing or writing, and nope, it’s not that easy. It’s a task that requires great skill, and ideally, time, to do the original work justice. Tayler’s right – it is translation and it’s a completely different animal from simply making a spoken language visible via words and sentences in the *same* language.

  Debby, I agree – I see no reason to heap vitriol on Jamie. I may disagree with her request to translate every single video blog, but it was politely phrased and she was able to back it up with valid points that are food for thought.

  I think Janis, who commented over on my blog at http://randomthoughtsnmusings.blogspot.com/2007/01/captioning-all-v-logs-really.html is right – there should be some v-logs that are captioned as a sort of “gateway,” while others are not in order to help people improve their skills. It’s a good incentive. Tons of good comments over there with many intriguing points.
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  *Boston | January 26th, 2007 @ 12:43 pm

  Carl said it best.
  To each artist makes his or own masterpiece.
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  tayler | January 26th, 2007 @ 12:50 pm

  Everyone, a lot of different issues are popping up about captioning vlogs. They are all good. But the point of my entry is that…. captioning our vlogs is extra work because it requires translation — while the companies do not have to translate. It’s just transfer from voice to text, and as Jared says, it’s already been done.
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  Michele | January 26th, 2007 @ 1:29 pm

  I don’t know of any easy answer to this dilemna for those who want captioning on personal vlogs, perhaps this person could send a private email to the vlogger and have them explain what they talked about or the vlogger could type up a text form along with the vlog. I believe once there are many vlogs that pop up, deaf people who have weak reception in ASL will be able to improve their receptive skills, this is a good way to learn diverse ASL. It is an education itself and a great opportunity for people to learn ASL.
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  SKE | January 26th, 2007 @ 1:32 pm

  Excuse me! What about SLCC do not give the large money to support ASL and Deaf Studies for equal access in that new building called Deaf Center? Huh? I do see NAD do NOTHING about respect ASL and Deaf Studies in 50% for equal access. So we do have RIGHT to entitle to our opinions!

  For so many years that we do bear with no closed captioned on some (not all) TV channels. Thanks for reading my “Leave a Reply”.

  Warm ASL Regards, SKE
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  Ben Vess | January 26th, 2007 @ 1:38 pm

  Welcome to the age of globalization. It is now nearly impossible not to “translate” what we say. Come to think of it, tv shows, movies, and etcetera are syndicated worldwide and aired in several different languages simutaneously.

  Take Spanish, for example.

  But, that’s irrelevant, to be honest. Let’s think about the reality here: the majority of the world speaks English or at least know the basic form of it. In the Olympics, English is the primary language–the second, french, and so forth. It’s quite simple, really:

  If we want our voices to be heard by the majority then we must speak their language.

  Vladimir Nabokov translated his works in English, Russian, and French. Thomas Jefferson could speak at least seven languages. In Europe, it’s unusual for one to know only one language.

  Consider yourself special, you have the responsibility to two communities, have equal respect for both English and ASL, ensure your voice is heard accordingly as you desire..

  English and ASL must go hand in hand like many other languages.

  If you want to change that–establish a written form of ASL. Maybe then, you might have a legitimate argument.
• 

  ChrisH | January 26th, 2007 @ 2:08 pm

  Micheal

  It sounds to me that you force all deaf to learn ASL that becomes perfect without English.
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  BEG | January 26th, 2007 @ 2:13 pm

  However, the issue really isn’t that simple.

  The deafblind, for example, have as much right to request subtitling (the more proper term, as I understand it, when translation is involved) of vlogs as we do to request that audio transmissions be captioned.

  In both cases, you are talking about a population of people that cannot simply go off and “learn” to see (in the first case) or “learn” to hear (in the second case).

  So, the requests are not outrageous, although I think it’s clear that some vlogs will be subtitled and others will not and that’s pretty much how it is. Just be kind and direct people over to vlogs that are subtitled if you get a request for that…

  (btw, I am a non-signing (learning!) deaf who has to ask everyone for captioning or subtitling, so this tends to be a topic near to my heart…)
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  MikeS | January 26th, 2007 @ 2:15 pm

  “You cannot really appreciate ASL as a true language until you try translating it.” Very true and that’s from hands on experience. It took me 2 hours to close caption a five mins. signed video. I didn’t realize my ASL was so rich in content and required further translations. Thanks.
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  Amy Cohen Efron | January 26th, 2007 @ 2:22 pm

  Hi Tayler -

  I admire your stance about the complications of captioning vlogs, and it is indeed a translation process that some people did not realize how much work it entails.

  The process itself is a HUGE task, and you wrote it so well.

  It was my intention to provide captions/voice-over for one specific vlog, “Life Intimates Art or Art Intimates Life” because I feel that this vlog needs to go out to the larger audience.

  What I’ve been trying to do so far…is much more complicated than I realized.

  First – English is my *second* language, and my first “language” which I feel should be called as “Amy’s visual space” which includes a mismash of English words I lipread, saw and read (visually). People may think that my first language is English. The more I thought, if we want to define the word, language in the strictest way — I was NOT fluent in English LANGUAGE, therefore my language use of English is not at the par where I wanted to be.

  In order to caption my vlogs – it requires translation /interpreting skills as Tayler said.

  What I did was I contacted one certified top-notch ASL interpreter who did the script for me, and, bless her heart, she did a pro bono work for me with understanding that I’ll credit for her work on my vlog and I have my script ready… but learning how to incorporate the script to captions in my vlog (“Life Intimates Art”) plus voice over… is one VERY complicated process that requires the highest learning curve for a person like me who is new with this! I am like a one-person production… so it was not easy.

  It is the same for 10 years ago when the world wide web was created, everyone needs to learn the HTML language to create webpages until several softwares were developed to make the HTML programming job much easy.

  Right now, there is no easy software available for me to export, edit, tweak, manipulate, caption, voice-over, save, compress, and import my vlog online!

  I realized that one minute of raw footage requires at least ONE hour of process. It is a labor of love and a gift to you all. If you wish to have this captioned, please add another 2 hours for a one-minute vlog!

  Think about this…

  One minute of raw footage in ASL is equivalent to one written paragraph that you could create in at least 35 seconds, and post it by pressing the ‘submit’ button here!

  Now – for me to share my thoughts in ASL for only one minute is equal to one hour of work! Mind you, I am not complaining because I am very proud of my work. I can certainly see the impact of my work to the community. It is worth it.

  If anyone who is willing to work with me for translation, another person who is willing to work with captions, and another person who is willing to add voice-over part to my vlog – then it is a collaboration work.

  TV production is never one-person job, it is always requires the team of professionals. I envy Gallaudet where they created the top-notch high quality vlogs (see example: Bob’s Weekly Vlog) and these vlogs are considered the highest standard ever.

  I desire to reach this standard. I want this standard. I know my limitations, I am only one person, with a full time job, with a full plate of responsibilities and obligations… I just cannot achieve this kind of standard alone. I need a team.

  I cannot translate my own ASL so that is a challenge because English is my second language anyway, and I am not an interpreter too. So they cannot really expect us, the vloggers to become interpreters too.

  Jamie Berke – your points are well intentioned and valid – and at the same time, is it realistic for one person?

  Thank you Tayler for bringing this up – and perhaps – the vlogging ‘explosion’ may will unify the Deaf Community because creating a vlog requires a team effort?

  Let’s see…

  Amy Cohen Efron
• 

  Rene Visco | January 26th, 2007 @ 3:28 pm

  That’s why we must pay attention to this project:

  http://openandclosed.org/activities/

  We must get involved to ensure that there are better standards in captioning in diverse media.
• 

  Amy Cohen Efron | January 26th, 2007 @ 3:35 pm

  Rene…

  INTERESTING!

  I read the definition of subtitling and captioning. both are not the same!

  Subtitling is a written translation of dialogue. It can be applied to a range of film, video, and multimedia formats, including television, home video, first-run movies, and online video.

  Captioning is the transcription of speech and important sound effects for the benefit of deaf and hard-of-hearing viewers and others. It can be applied to a range of film, video, and multimedia formats, including television, home video, first-run movies, online video, installations, and more.

  So therefore, *captioning* ASL vlogs is not the right word! It is subtitling ASL vlogs…. how interesting!!!!!

  Thank you for sharing that with us Rene!

  Amy Cohen Efron
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  Rene Visco | January 26th, 2007 @ 3:50 pm

  Amy,

  Believe me, it’s very hard for me to create DVD subtitles, open-captions for video clips, and it’s a lot of work like Tayler said.

  Because the standards of using captions or subtites are varied, like .src, .txt. .xml, .stl, etc. It’s a madness trying to sort it out.

  So, this Open and Closed project is very important. Joe Clark wrote this in the website:

  “This project will be led by researchers and people with disabilities, not business

  On the Open & Closed Project’s planned board of directors, the combined total of researchers and people with disabilities will hold the majority. Industry may be represented on the board, but this is a research project, not an industry or marketing project”

  I’m working on my letter of support for this project based on excellent ideas and good intentions.

  We cannot afford to wait and see how this project goes. We must participate!
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  SKE | January 26th, 2007 @ 5:08 pm

  True, good points Amy!!! Captioning on ASL Vlogs too much work for one full time working person and do the work around at home, too!

  Also good point about ASL is not voicing. Captioning belongs to the noisings, voicings and sounds effect background! Thank you Amy for bring that up!

  ASL Regards, SKE
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  MM | January 28th, 2007 @ 2:49 am

  I’ll be brief and basic ! I’m deaf, but I don’t understand ASL so unless you caption I’m out.
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  rg007 | January 28th, 2007 @ 5:01 pm

  RLM, if you can’t say anything nice to or about someone, or if your information isn’t quite true or or is bad, shut up. You still haven’t learned, have you? You have to remember that not everyone has a good grasp of ASL, even though some sign a little differently. If you used a transcript of the vlog and put it underneath the video, it works just as well. You sure you sent her an email about this?

  And yes, Amy and Rene, you two are absolutely correct on the definition of subtitles and captions. I’m seeing some movies out there that says “subtitled for the deaf and hard of hearing” or “English SDH.” Just about every movie out there on DVD is subtitled *AND* captioned. You’ve seen the different filetypes for subtitles out there.

  Making a request for the subtitling/captioning/transcriptioning versus a demand for it are two different things. Making the vlog accessible to everyone, whether their ASL skills are good, not that great, or none, is a good idea. Sometimes even I prefer reading the transcripts. You’re essentially leaving out a portion of your audience if not.
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  Micah | February 4th, 2007 @ 9:06 am

  MM wrote: “I’ll be brief and basic ! I’m deaf, but I don’t understand ASL so unless you caption I’m out.”

  Which is a good point. My family is hearing. Sometimes they’ll walk in and I’m enjoying a vlog (say, one of Joey’s); and they’ll look at the ASL and most (if not all) of it will go over their heads. Surely, as bloggers/vloggers, we have an obligation to make our work more accessible to our audience? blogs are all in text. No matter who that person is, we can understand it. But what about YouTube videos? The vast majority are made by hearing people — without subtitles. As deaf people, we can appreciate the visual styles, but since the humor or whatever is all about what is being said, well, that’s over our heads.

  Just because hearing vlogs aren’t accessible to deaf people doesn’t give us the right to say, “well, ASL can’t be translated accurately so why bother trying”? And there’s even other options besides embedded subtitles. Bob Davila provides a transcript of what he is saying on his weekly vlogs. While Davila’s transcript isn’t word-for-word accurate, the basic meaning behind those signs is there. If embedding subtitles is too difficult, it’s not that hard to just type out what one is saying, right? Particularly since some people already write out what they say in order to make their vlogs smoother.

  Now, this isn’t to say that all vlogs should be subtitled or have transcripts available. A-Z poetry, for example, can’t be translated all that easily.

  Just my two quatloos.
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  Myra | March 12th, 2007 @ 2:00 pm

  I think that captioning is a good idea. I am working on my certification and sometimes I don’t understand some things that are being said. Having the captions helps me learn signs that I have never seen before.